TOPIC: 260 spots - display problem

Hi, I have custome version git364991a and my subscription is expiered with 2 tickets unresolved:
compojoom.com/support/support-tickets/ho...991a-merge-into-main
compojoom.com/support/support-tickets/ho...opens-wrong-language

I how have more serious problem.
Here you can see spots in Darwin, Australia
www.orthodox.net.au/en/darwin#!/catid=5;4;3;6;2;7;8

If you zoom the map out so you see hundreds of spots in Melbourne/Sydney, Darwin spots disapear altogether.
Same problem exists on other maps. I tried tiles but a) it looks ugly, dots instead of icons and b) it does not fix the problem.

Hey Alex,
I'm not really sure what went wrong with the tickets. Your subscription actually had to expire on the 11 of may, so you shouldn't have been able to reply to the tickets on the 22nd of may. But also - why the system closed them immediately after you replied is strange... Anyway as it seems to be a screw up on our side I modified your subscription and it will expire in 2 months. If you still need replies on those tickets, please submit new ones and I'll take care of them.

Back to the new problem. Read this chapter:
compojoom.com/support/documentation/hotspots/ch05#id1411799
and enable the custom tiles. The big markers will disappear but the users will still know that there are markers because they'll see the small dots.

Cheers,
Daniel

Hi Daniel,
I really appreciate extending my subscription!

I have enabled custom tiles, and the problem I get is some spots are normal markers, and from time to time you get dots. It's really confusing, at screenshot you can't really see there is spot at Warnambul (unless you looking for it), while spots at Geelong are clearly visible.
Custom tiles works OK if zoomed out; for close zoom they are playing up...

Sorry attachments does not work; tried IE and Chrome. Add file, click attach...

www.orthodox.net.au/media/dots%20as%20markers.png

I'm curious - what is so confusing about the custom tiles? Once turned on you always have the small dots. No matter what the zoom level. Google does the same. You get 20 markers that are shown with the standard icon, the rest are small dots -> that are clickable and give you an idea where you have more locations and where you need to zoom in/out.
In the settings of the component there is also an option to show more markers at once (max is 100) per category.

Kind regards,
Daniel

That's my problem - I don't always get dots!
Have a look at the screenshot:
www.orthodox.net.au/media/dots%20as%20markers.png

I see them all the time:
awesomescreenshot.com/0973dipn73

If you go to the category in the backend -> you'll see that you have a setting for the custom tiles. They don't have to be all black you know! You can set whatever color you like that matches the color of your category.
Then on the dashboard click the delete tiles button and after that when you browse the frontend they will be generated again.

I think MarkerClusterer is much better solution and this is what I often saw

developers.google.com/maps/articles/toomanymarkers

On your screeshot problem is exactly the same: half markers, half dots. Why markers in Melbourne and dots in Sydney, it does not make sense.
This is inconsistent, and dots are very easy to overlook.
I would understand this: if there are more then 100 markers in viewpoint -> they ALL became dots. Ok, that is easy to follow - zoom in, and you will see markers.

Colored dots may be better but does it not save the situation.

Good demo of various markers groups; without MarkerClusterer really hard to get the reasonable picture.
gmaps-samples-v3.googlecode.com/svn/trun.../toomanymarkers.html

Alex - I've spent time researching all the available algorithms for showing a lot of markers. I've put a lot of thoughts into all this.
With markerclusterer you have the same issue -> why are 20 locations shown with normal markers and the other 200 are merged together?
Look at this: awesomescreenshot.com/0153diyv87 why is google using the marker boundaries method + custom tiles if MarkerClusterer is so good? They have same thing. If you move around -> only few locations are shown with the normal marker icon. the rest are all dots...
In your case the problem is that you have a lot of categories and you are trying to show all hotsptos at once. So you end up with 200 hotspots with normal markers and only 20 dots... And the dots in this situation can get overlooked. This is an issue with v3, because we load x number of hotspots per category. In version 4 we load x spots from all categories. If you've set 20 hotspots in the backend -> you'll see 20 hotspots on the map and not 200. then you can navigate around, zoom in/out and the hotspots will refresh etc. Or the user can stay at the same view and change between pages.

But I'm not moving to the markerClusterer - unless someone comes with arguments why I should do so & he gives me an example what to do with the menu when the markerclusterer is there.

What I'm doing right now is optimizing the current algorithm for version 4. We have better looking dots, better results at low zoom levels & in general faster performance of the hotspots.

Regards,
Daniel

You can see the current progress of Hotspots 4.0 here: labs.compojoom.com/hotspots
If you have feedback, please post it here:
compojoom.com/forum/hotspots-core/19639-hotspots-4-0-beta-1

Thanks!

Hi Daniel,
Hotspots is the best map component available, I’ve done a lot of research and tried many of them. Still, I believe nothing created by man is perfect so there are ways to make it better.

>>>>>>>With markerclusterer you have the same issue -> why are 20 locations shown with normal markers and the other 200 are merged together?
If zoom out, markers often will former “clusters”. Most of “coffee” places are in the cities, with not so much in between. And this is “country” spots what I am looking for, travelling in between cities. If I need spots in the city, I will zoom in – with zoom out there are too many “city” markers and I can’t see them anyway. So it make sense to replace the whole city with area of markers. This send a clear message – if this is what you want, zoom in please.

>>>>Look at this: awesomescreenshot.com/0153diyv87 why is google using the marker boundaries method + custom tiles if MarkerClusterer is so good? They have same thing. If you move around -> only few locations are shown with the normal marker icon. the rest are all dots...
Google is great company, but they can’t shot 100% all the time. Can you see how user-unfriendly this “coffee” example is? Some icons, and a lot of dots. Why some spots deserve icons? Are they better than others? Did they pay for advertisement? No, they are all random. This does not make sense.

>>>>>>>>>>In your case the problem is that you have a lot of categories and you are trying to show all hotsptos at once.
Exactly. If I zoomed in the city, I want all spots with proper icons. If I zoom out for thousands of kilometres, it’s sufficient to see clusters with 55 spots in Melbourne, 86 in Sydney, the rest 20 individual spots are still displayed with proper icons, so I will not miss.

>>>>>>>So you end up with 200 hotspots with normal markers and only 20 dots... And the dots in this situation can get overlooked. This is an issue with v3, because we load x number of hotspots per category. In version 4 we load x spots from all categories. If you've set 20 hotspots in the backend -> you'll see 20 hotspots on the map and not 200.
This will be misleading, there are another 180 spots? The user will think: I can only see 20 spots, and that’s all, what a rubbish website – I know there should be much more spots.
If you stay with custom tiles, I think the algorithm should be: if less than 100 spots visible – display icons, if over a 100 display dots. This may get tricky if you zoom/pan the map into an area with lots of spots; if this case all icons should be replaced by dots; you can even display a message: zoom in to see icons. In any case, there should be all icons or all dots, not a mixture.

>>>>>>But I'm not moving to the markerClusterer - unless someone comes with arguments why I should do so & he gives me an example what to do with the menu when the markerclusterer is there.
My arguments are above. In regards to the menu, I think it’s useful only if you have handful of spots in the area; as soon as you have 20+ spots it’s not useful at all. The list is too long and there is simply not enough space. I have custom table instead and I think module doing the same will be more useful for a large lists.
www.orthodox.net.au/en/orthodox-australia/serbian

>>>>>What I'm doing right now is optimizing the current algorithm for version 4. We have better looking dots, better results at low zoom levels & in general faster performance of the hotspots.
I’m looking forward to this. In the meanwhile, can I prevent user from zooming out too much? Can I place a limit on zoom? This will prevent too many spots in a viewable area.

Hey Alex,
I've argued in the past about nearly the same thing
You are forgetting how we use the map. If I want to go for a coffee - I know where I want to go. I want to go in Berlin, in the city center. Then I'll zoom over this area and I'll see the locations there. When I've zoomed in, then I can say -> good I'll be on street bla bla at 14 o'clock and I can drink coffee on street bla bla at 15 o'clock.
If you know where you want to be, then navigating the map is not an issue.
How many people are going to look at the whole map for Australia looking for churches??? If I'm from Melbourne, then I most probably want to see the churches in Melbourne and not in Sidney. If you think for a second - the dots give you exactly an idea where you can zoom in. The dots also have the added benefit, that when you move with your mouse over them, you can actually click on them without having to zoom in. (and that you can't do with the markerclusterer)

Did you see the demo of Hotspots 4. It shows only 20(you can also change this to 100) normal markers and the rest are the custom tiles. In the menu you have a pagination (which I'll place also above the hotspots) so in my opinion it is more than clear that in the current zoom level you have more hotspots than currently visible.

>>>How many people are going to look at the whole map for Australia looking for churches???

Here are real life scenarios:
1. I am driving on the coast from Melbourne to Sydney. I will certainly stop by church which is on my way (and I don't know exactly where it is)
2. I want to contact aboriginal missionary. I know this will be somewhere... far from the big city, no idea where exactly.
3. I need a list of small town parishes.

I saw v.4 demo and same as Google example, I don't get why some spots have icons and others are just dots. This is inconsistent and confusing.
Look, if you can provide an option for MarkerClusterer, great. Is it very hard?
If you can't give MarkerClusterer option: can you count number of spots in the window? <100 display all icons, 101+ display all dots - at least this is consistent