TOPIC: Old vs New Template Options

Hello Yves,
Will some of the old template features be available in the new? Or do the options already exist and I’ve simply not activated them. For example:

1. Forms –

• Tool tips – this would be useful to guide users if just using the new template.
• Form field sorting – being able to add Additional Fields from the old form anywhere on a new form instead of having the fields appear at the end of a form as default.
• Increasing the amount of text that can be used for the spacer text form field (obviously only for the new form).

2. Event Listing in the Front End – is it possible to have some info text at the head of the event list page in the front end, this can be done with the old template but I can’t see where the text can be added at the head of the event list page in the front end for the new template. The info helps create a more user friendly experience by informing users what they need to do (this may be obvious to us but not them), for example:

• Register and log in or Log in to make a booking.
• Click on the title of the event to view more details about the booking
• Only the minimum booking fees are listed on this page

Look forward to your response.

Mr B

Hi,

1.)- You can already have tooltips in the new booking form (but a bit different - there is a setting for that generating translation strings starting, e.g. your label + _DESC).

Form field sorting – being able to add Additional Fields from the old form anywhere on a new form instead of having the fields appear at the end of a form as default.

-Not with the current additional fields, they will be replaced through a better and more userfriendly solution in a later version (and then maybe with positioning between the global ones)

Increasing the amount of text that can be used for the spacer text form field (obviously only for the new form).

Hmm that isn't limited - you can use as much text as you want.

2.)

is it possible to have some info text at the head of the event list page in the front end, this can be done with the old template but I can’t see where the text can be added at the head of the event list page in the front end for the new template

Hmm you are the first wanting it back - added an option for that to the wishlist. Always thought about showing the category description (which Matukio currently ignores) there.

Kind regards,

Yves

Hello Yves!

Thanks for you informative reply. The spacer text form field is limited to 250 characters. If you input the following text (250 characters including spaces and quotes) you cannot input anything else :

"Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Praesent quis enim quam. Curabitur pellentesque suscipit odio ut accumsan. In hac habitasse platea dictumst. Aliquam lectus eros, feugiat ac sodales quis, egestas quis risus. Proin quis velit"

The description at the head of the event list page, in the front end, would be welcome addition if it can be applied in the same or a similar way as for the old template. Finally, could you give a screen shot display of how to display a tool tip using the new template, as label + _DESC makes little sense to me.

Thanks Yves.

The spacer text form field is limited to 250 characters. If you input the following text (250 characters including spaces and quotes) you cannot input anything else :

Aye that's because it is saved as varchar, do you really need more then 250 chars? You are the first one who complains, no big deal changing it tinytext or text - but that makes SQL-Queries slower.

The _DESC ist thought for translation strings / placeholders e.g. you keep the caption COM_MATUKIO_CITY and _DESC will be added - then you can create (under Extensions -> Languages -> Overrides) a translation with a long text for it.

Kind regards,

Yves

P.S.: Better (separate column) tooltips will come with Matukio 5 - have it high on my todo-list!

Hello Yves,

Thanks for your reply. No! 250 characters would not be necessary in many cases (though varchar is for variable-length strings of up to 65,535 characters used with 5.0.3 and greater MySQL databases.) But for the form with the new template, this is one way to provide additional information for the user as your _DESC tooltip explanation is still mystifying.

Are you saying that adding text to the value of a booking field Constant, from the language override, is the best way to add an explanation/tooltip? Does this not just lengthen the label for the field? You have managed to use tooltips in the backend for your component, how have you done this?

Is it your intention to eventually migrate all the features from the old template to the new template and eliminate the old template altogether? I assume this would really make your life easier and have one exceptional component rather than a bridge between two. Thanks

Mr B

Are you saying that adding text to the value of a booking field Constant, from the language override, is the best way to add an explanation/tooltip?

Let's talk me through this, let's say your caption is COM_MATUKIO_CITY, then with _DESC it becomes COM_MATUKIO_CITY_DESC - this one can be used for long descriptions (tooltips on mouse over) with an language override:

docs.joomla.org/J2.5:Language_Overrides_in_Joomla

e.g. just set COM_MATUKIO_CITY_DESC = My nice tooltip text

I know this is far from optimal, this is just a workaround suggestion as long as there are no better tooltips in the new form (coming with Matukio 5)

Is it your intention to eventually migrate all the features from the old template to the new template and eliminate the old template altogether?

No, remove is the wrong word Going to keep the style but merge the code in all three (one more to come) templates, so that they all share the same functionality just have a different layout (which will also be much easier editable, because most application logic will be removed out of the default template).

Kind regards,

Yves

P.S.:

250 characters would not be necessary in many cases (though varchar is for variable-length strings of up to 65,535 characters used with 5.0.3 and greater MySQL databases.

Yeah, i know but it's a field varchar with a length val of 255 currently Would need to alter the table field varchar (255) to varchar (65534) - no big deal, when necessary

Hello Yves,

Thanks for your reply. Your talk through for a tooltip workaround simply did not work for me. I really hope with Matukio 5 (when is the release?) you include the most basic features of original Seminar component, such as tooltips, templates for events (in the back end) and a Description sector at the top of the Event list in the front end. This will allow whoever configures your component is able to produce a user friendly appearance for anybody making a booking. I can see you have put a lot of effort into the remodelling/coding of the component and version Matukio 5 looks impressive. Let us hope it is not all just sizzle without the steak!

In the back end, with the latest component release, I notice some titles with a constant and not its value e.g “LIB_COMPOJOOM_WELC” instead of “Welcome”, followed by Super User. Here is feature you could consider. When editing an event you are only aware of its title under the “Basic Settings” tab. Any chance of the Event’s title appearing as constant value, displayed at the top of the page, above the tabs, to remind the administrator during editing of what event they are editing?

OK, one last question. The location, date and time title of an event that appears in Event list in the front end has a preposition “at”, which may sound OK in its German form but is incorrect in English. The preposition preferred is “on”, so something is - on - a particular day and not - at - a particular day. This could be changed in the old seminar language .ini file by editing something similar to: SEM_0166=%A, %B %d, %Y at %I:%M%p I cannot find where to edit this with the new template. Could you please tell me? I have also noticed that to edit the Matukio language .ini file disables any searches for the Matukio component Constants when making a search through the Joomla! language overrides function (had to reinstall component to get it working again.) Once more thanks for your effort.

Mr B

Hello,

Your talk through for a tooltip workaround simply did not work for me

Hmm, should i make a sample on your site?

In the back end, with the latest component release, I notice some titles with a constant and not its value e.g “LIB_COMPOJOOM_WELC” instead of “Welcome”, followed by Super User.

Aye, the library language files were screwed up with the latest release, will be fixed again with the next version.

When editing an event you are only aware of its title under the “Basic Settings” tab. Any chance of the Event’s title appearing as constant value, displayed at the top of the page, above the tabs, to remind the administrator during editing of what event they are editing?

Okay done, comes with Matukio 5 - the slogan will be replaced with the event title (if any): awesomescreenshot.com/0a63gqch08

This could be changed in the old seminar language .ini file by editing something similar to: SEM_0166=%A, %B %d, %Y at %I:%M%p I cannot find where to edit this with the new template. Could you please tell me?

Interesting didn't realize that, will change that for everyone (in the new bootstrap template it isn't shown anyway but in the modern one).

Easiest way to change that meanwhile is making an language override (don't think that i use that one else where as in this context) for COM_MATUKIO_AT just change it to on (Joomla -> Extensions -> Languages -> Overrides).

Kind regards,

Yves

Hello Yves,

Thanks for your reply. I’m developing my site on a localhost at the moment, so you would not be able to access the site. It would be great if you could provide some screen shots or a mini (video) tutorial for the procedure of adding tool tips so that anyone can make use of the information. I believe you mentioned that tool tips will be part of Matukio 5!

Adding the title of the event, at the head of the page, of the event that is being edited in the back end will be a welcome addition.

The display of the “Ticket type” value is not displayed alongside “Normal” if there are different fees and an option to book more than one place, along with the red asterisk (star) denoting the field is required. Is this a bug or just an omission for some reason? Additionally, the drop down list for “Places to book” field next to the “Ticket type” field on the booking form always starts from 1. My event booking is for a group of a minimum of 3 and maximum of 5 participants and I have put these numbers under the “Basic Settings” tab for the event. So shouldn’t the “Places to book” field begin with 3 not 1?

Mr B

Hello,

Tooltips and a lot of other things are already done (No more tables, 100 % responsive bootstrap 3 layout, multiple places -> data per seat and much more)

Backend:

awesomescreenshot.com/0ec3hopkbc

Booking form:

awesomescreenshot.com/0ac3hoorda

The display of the “Ticket type” value is not displayed alongside “Normal” if there are different fees and an option to book more than one place, along with the red asterisk (star) denoting the field is required. Is this a bug or just an omission for some reason?

Hmm not really a bug, had it not on all different options - changed that already.

My event booking is for a group of a minimum of 3 and maximum of 5 participants and I have put these numbers under the “Basic Settings” tab for the event.

Hmm we have no option for that - the option "minimum pupil" is not for that It's for the cronjobs deciding if an event should be cancelled or not etc - it has nothing to do with the bookingform.

Kind regards,

Yves

Hello Yves,

Thanks for your reply. Mmmm… The selection for the amount of participants is not an obvious but understandable function when you describe cron jobs. I assumed its main function was to multiply one or different fees. But as there is the option to select the “Add” button to multiply a fee, I see there are different ways to for fees to be calculated. Nice to see the tooltip field added for the new booking for in Mat’5. Will you offer a tooltip possibility for the “Ticket type” field?

Back to the booking fields for the new template. Have you considered that each field does not have to appear, by default, on ALL booking forms and the fields can be selected to appear only on certain forms? (This is a useful function used in Joomprod’s Adsmanger forms.) Such a feature would be a big plus in the flexibility of Matukio and this is where templates for events would come in useful. I know you want Mat’5 to be a much improved and practical component when it is released. Can we expect its début this year? Thanks again.

Mr B

Will you offer a tooltip possibility for the “Ticket type” field?

Hmm what would you like to show there? You can use a text placeholder at the beginning to describe them

Back to the booking fields for the new template. Have you considered that each field does not have to appear, by default, on ALL booking forms and the fields can be selected to appear only on certain forms? (This is a useful function used in Joomprod’s Adsmanger forms.) Such a feature would be a big plus in the flexibility of Matukio and this is where templates for events would come in useful.

Hmm we have it the other way around - if you don't want to show a field on the bookingform for every event you don't have it in the global fields, but in the event specific fields (same result). We are going to change the booking field behavior and event specific bookingfields again after Matukio 5, we are going to integrate a real form builder then.

Kind regards,

Yves

Hello Yves,

Thanks for your reply. I would hope that most of what has been written in this thread will not be an issue with the release of Mat’5.
Because of the way the current Matukio release is structured, having custom additional booking fields will always come after the fields of the new template. Having a few of these additional booking fields would not give a spacer with text the proximity to the ticket type field for a subsequent explanation. Though as you have stated major changes in Mat’5 to the forms, amongst other issues, there seems to be little point in reviving the matters covered already between the old and new template, which you plan to resolve.

Have you heard of Steve Krug? He has a book called: Don’t Make Me Think - A Common Sense Approach to Web Usability. It is guide to making a web site more user friendly for visitors to a site. The back end of Matukio is resource rich and challenging for anyone to make the best use of your component. In its current form all the bells and whistles for Matukio are good but with all that fantastic noise, let us hope it will be more harmonious with the release of Mat’5, for its users, front and back end. Thanks again.

Mr B

Hi Mr B,

Because of the way the current Matukio release is structured, having custom additional booking fields will always come after the fields of the new template.

Aye this is the biggest down side on the current solution and that will not be fixed directly in the very first version of Matukio 5 (at least it is planned like that - for that the first new version will be out much sooner - October probably - first release candidate coming probably this weekend.)

We really put in great effort on usability, especially in the frontend - in the backend it's most times a tradeoff between features, flexibility and customizability. Matukio is based on Seminar, which was on some parts quite a mess (It was a not MVC Joomla 1.0 extension!) and it has been a long progress to the current state and while that we also added tons of new modern features.. Retrospectively it was a mistake to not start from scratch, i almost rewrote every line of Seminar, sometimes even two or three times.. Matukio is by far one of the most advanced event managers in the Joomla world, most other event extensions don't even have half of the possibilities.

Kind regards,

Yves

P.S.: Take a look at matukio.compojoom.com for a live preview of Matukio 5 - would really value your feedback!